[3.13] Lancing Steel Deadeye/Raider | Very Fun Playstyle | 4-50M DPS Easy Gearing Path

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DnLx3 escreveu:

Why do you still have Point Blank, when you use Far Shot through belltimber blade?
Also still Pride. isn't Pride useless with Far Shot? Since the area is less than the Far Shot Range.

idk, but something feels off with the tree

nonetheless, i'm gonna league start with this.

Make sure you are selecting matching passive and gear sets in PoB. "Endgame" gear as I have it defined does not use Beltimber. "Early Mapping" gear uses Beltimber and as such the "Early Mapping" passive configuration does not have Point Blank.

That said, I was concerned about pride, so I did a little testing before updating and here are my findings:

* Range of L20, 20% pride seems to be 60-70
* Increase AoE support doesn't seem to affect pride (maybe a bug, since the UI indicates it should on mouse-over?)
* Point Blank and Far Shot actually aren't totally bad together. They basically give you some amount of bonus regardless of distance when you take both. A mix of info from GGG with educated guesses and experiments:

Range 0 = 1.3 * 0.8 = 4% more
Range 35 = 1 (assuming the break-even point is set the same on both)
Range 70 = 1.6 * 0.9 = 44% more (still better than just Point Blank at range 0)
Range 150 = 1.6 * 0.7 = 12% more (this is way offscreen)

This could be a valid preference if you don't like dancing around to keep the right distance.

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Seiyashi7184 escreveu:

What does anyone think of the idea of league starting as Raider, then once you accumulate the requisite alternate quality gems (Blood Rage and Poacher's Mark) and the necessary gear to cap evasion and dodge as Deadeye (e.g. Atziri's Step), respeccing into Deadeye? To my mind, it's probably a little too much trouble for SC league start, but is maintaining high dodge and evasion important enough to go through this trouble?

My build is really far from something you'd want to try on HC, although it would probably be viable with a bunch of changes.

The alt quality gems are only important for bossing, which really only means mapping and end game bosses to me at least. They're not necessary, just hard to make anything close to the same damage numbers if you give up reliable frenzy charges.

For me the problem with defenses is the other way around in SC: early game it really doesn't matter, there's no punishment for a few deaths. Later on once you hit yellow/red maps is when you really need to start worrying about beefing those defenses way up. To me that seems to indicate that the progression should be Deadeye start, Raider for endgame, maybe Deadeye for late-late endgame once you can hit the same caps again without too many sacrifices (it's really hard to do).

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Make sure you are selecting matching passive and gear sets in PoB. "Endgame" gear as I have it defined does not use Beltimber. "Early Mapping" gear uses Beltimber and as such the "Early Mapping" passive configuration does not have Point Blank.

That said, I was concerned about pride, so I did a little testing before updating and here are my findings:

* Range of L20, 20% pride seems to be 60-70
* Increase AoE support doesn't seem to affect pride (maybe a bug, since the UI indicates it should on mouse-over?)
* Point Blank and Far Shot actually aren't totally bad together. They basically give you some amount of bonus regardless of distance when you take both. A mix of info from GGG with educated guesses and experiments:

Range 0 = 1.3 * 0.8 = 4% more
Range 35 = 1 (assuming the break-even point is set the same on both)
Range 70 = 1.6 * 0.9 = 44% more (still better than just Point Blank at range 0)
Range 150 = 1.6 * 0.7 = 12% more (this is way offscreen)

This could be a valid preference if you don't like dancing around to keep the right distance

Oh well.
Sometimes my own stupidity reaches the stars.
im sorry :D

so basically you can still run pride, but you probably have to give up on maximum Far Shot range.

Since i want to start as a Raider and not as a Deadeye, i changed the "leveling trees" a bit. I hope i did everything correct.

Thank you for this build.

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immcintosh escreveu:

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Seiyashi7184 escreveu:

What does anyone think of the idea of league starting as Raider, then once you accumulate the requisite alternate quality gems (Blood Rage and Poacher's Mark) and the necessary gear to cap evasion and dodge as Deadeye (e.g. Atziri's Step), respeccing into Deadeye? To my mind, it's probably a little too much trouble for SC league start, but is maintaining high dodge and evasion important enough to go through this trouble?

My build is really far from something you'd want to try on HC, although it would probably be viable with a bunch of changes.

The alt quality gems are only important for bossing, which really only means mapping and end game bosses to me at least. They're not necessary, just hard to make anything close to the same damage numbers if you give up reliable frenzy charges.

For me the problem with defenses is the other way around in SC: early game it really doesn't matter, there's no punishment for a few deaths. Later on once you hit yellow/red maps is when you really need to start worrying about beefing those defenses way up. To me that seems to indicate that the progression should be Deadeye start, Raider for endgame, maybe Deadeye for late-late endgame once you can hit the same caps again without too many sacrifices (it's really hard to do).

Hmm. What about Raider playing a Point Blank version with Grelwood Shank instead? Wind Dancer and Kintsugi allows you to take hits, and evasion and dodge ensure they're spaced out enough for those two to recover.

Great build! I was wondering what you think on the graceful assault notable for the raider version, given that 60% increased onslaught effect! Thanks!

Have you tried a similar setup on Gladiator?

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DnLx3 escreveu:

so basically you can still run pride, but you probably have to give up on maximum Far Shot range.

Since i want to start as a Raider and not as a Deadeye, i changed the "leveling trees" a bit. I hope i did everything correct.

Thank you for this build.

Pretty much. It's actually hard to really mess up the build as long as you're taking damage and health nodes. There's nothing that's really required, it's just a matter of ending up with the biggest numbers.

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Seiyashi7184 escreveu:

Hmm. What about Raider playing a Point Blank version with Grelwood Shank instead? Wind Dancer and Kintsugi allows you to take hits, and evasion and dodge ensure they're spaced out enough for those two to recover.

I think Grelwood Shank is 100% no-go unless you want to drastically change the build. It gives you Iron Reflexes which turns all your evasion to armor when stationary, but I don't see how that would ever work well. Also, you only get the +2 projectiles if you've been hit recently, which is not something you want to be doing.

As for Wind Dancer and Kintsugi, those are only secondary defenses after evasion and they don't work with armor at all.

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Acarvalho escreveu:

Great build! I was wondering what you think on the graceful assault notable for the raider version, given that 60% increased onslaught effect! Thanks!

That amounts to 12% increased attack and movement speed, 20% damage, and some evasion. For 4 points that's not too amazing.

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TigersDragon escreveu:

Have you tried a similar setup on Gladiator?

Do you mean Champion? Gladiator is not good for this skill. Last league Champion could theoretically get higher DPS numbers by a bit, but with Master of Metal nerfed this league it's at best equal. I like playing Raider because of the massive move speed really. Champion is still a perfectly good Lancing Steel option and you could basically just swap the entry points of the passive tree around and leave everything else the same as a starting poing.

You could even consider Berserker if you want to go full on glass cannon. I think it has the highest potential DPS.

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immcintosh escreveu:

Do you mean Champion? Gladiator is not good for this skill. Last league Champion could theoretically get higher DPS numbers by a bit, but with Master of Metal nerfed this league it's at best equal. I like playing Raider because of the massive move speed really. Champion is still a perfectly good Lancing Steel option and you could basically just swap the entry points of the passive tree around and leave everything else the same as a starting poing.

You could even consider Berserker if you want to go full on glass cannon. I think it has the highest potential DPS.

Why is gladiator not good for this skill? I've been working on a gladiator version in pob with 70% block without taking a big hit to dps. Haven't tested it out in game though. Are bleedsplosions pointless?

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Sabbea escreveu:

Why is gladiator not good for this skill? I've been working on a gladiator version in pob with 70% block without taking a big hit to dps. Haven't tested it out in game though. Are bleedsplosions pointless?

I'd be curious to see your PoB and how you are getting bleed to do good damage with this skill.

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immcintosh escreveu:

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Sabbea escreveu:

Why is gladiator not good for this skill? I've been working on a gladiator version in pob with 70% block without taking a big hit to dps. Haven't tested it out in game though. Are bleedsplosions pointless?

I'd be curious to see your PoB and how you are getting bleed to do good damage with this skill.

PM'd

Are the 5 points not worth to get Swift Skewering or Blade Sovereign?