[3.16] ❄️ Peak Performance Ice Shot Deadeye ❄️ | Deceivingly Tanky | Start>Endgame

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JKR_ escreveu:

Nice write-up, have a video of your Maven kill to check out?

Like an idiot, I only remembered to record it like halfway through the fight so I decided not to. It was an embarrassing fight eitherway as my first time and I used up 3 portals. I also sold the remaining Maven's Writ cause the drops seems cheap this league other than the Maven Orb.

Maybe if I decided to fight her again I'll record it.

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WrongBlight escreveu:

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a pierce Voidfletcher becomes very usable unlike before

Not unless you want to halve your single target dps. Hydrosphere x2 damage interaction requires you to have no pierce since cone procs off hydrosphere > proj chains into boss. If you pierce hydropshere = no x2, and pierce is used up before chain, so any pierce = big nono still.

Usually you wanted added fire damage corrupted fletcher to be able to use cinderswallow to proc 10% more dmg taken vs ignited from it, unless some fire damage on some jewellery.

The pierce interaction with Hydrosphere is wrong, Ice shot's cone still procs off hydrosphere with pierce. The only downside of pierce for the build is Ensnaring Arrow won't proc because it needs to finish its pierce & chain (vs just chain which can proc of Hydrosphere > projectile tethering on the boss). You can read those bits in the wiki.

https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Ice_Shot
https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Ensnaring_Arrow

I've also tested it again this morning to be sure. Try it out yourself if you're not convinced. The reason I said pierce Voidfletcher becomes very usable unlike before is due to automation of Hydrosphere and Sniper's Mark proj. splitting.

Hydrosphere automated casting means Hydrosphere positioning on top of enemies becomes extremely easy, which makes Ice Shot pierce + cone easy to hit (unlike before with manual casting, chain is typically needed to properly 'track' the target)

Clearing used to suffer alot when your projectile pierce first and chain. Sniper's Mark projectile splits (with Focal Point increased effect) causes a huge number of added projectiles similar to Tornado Shot explosion (but can still pierce, chain, procs Ice Shot cone). This greatly mitigates that downside of pierce Voidfletcher.

I don't really like the post-nerf version of Dying Sun & Cinderswallow, the charge cost is just way too high IMO for it to be sustainable, even with 'Gain flask charge when crit'. Even more so when they've allowed utility flasks to have that inc. crit chance suffix to roll.

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WrongBlight escreveu:

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I've played a lightning arrow version of this build last league and it was definitively a worse version. Freeze is just simply too good.

Lightning arrow setup was for clear. Most sane ice shot builds played ice shot for ST, LA for clear as 2 6 links.

LA freezes perfectly fine / has mostly cold damage with just 40% converted and awk added cold 5, and has incomparably better clear from +2 implicit chains.

I made the build with the idea in mind that it can be built without any currencies to really kick off, and having to have 2 6L (with double the awakened gems later) is definitely an idea I'd stay away from. Let me elaborate the problem I have with Lightning Arrow:

https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Lightning_Arrow

1. Lightning arrow hits up to 3 additional nearby target. This means your arrow will only hit 4 target per arrow (1 main arrow, 3 skill effect). Ice Shot cone in comparison hits in an AOE (no numerical limit to targets inside it, unless maybe something like 100 target limit inside the game's hardcoding like Sweep). So no, I don't really think LA clears better than Ice Shot from this reasoning alone.

2. Shock effect. I never really like shocking enemies with skill because it usually is not enough on bosses and too much on normal mobs due to how ailment threshold works. With my LA playthrough, I only managed to consistently shock bosses up to roughly 30-40% most of the time, with endgame bosses even lower. With Ice Shot & Skitterbots + Bonechill, the enemies have a consistent 17% Shock & 16% inc. damage taken from Skitterbot Bonechill aura, to a total of 33% consistently. Ice Shot still have its increased effect of cold ailment and chill effect on the skill.

3. Voidfletcher. Voidfletcher Void Shots have the same scaling as Ice Shot (Projectile, Phys>Cold), so when you scale one you also scale the other at 100% efficiency (or better if you have added projectile). Also lightning nodes are not as accessible on the right side of the tree as compared to cold.

4. Freeze. You might argue that LA freezes enough with enough added cold damage sources. Of course, so does every other skills if you do that. Ice Shot have an inherent chill & cold ailment effect already on the gem, and has its own source of added cold damage. I've actually struggled with the build to freeze bosses on Blight-Ravaged maps, where the monsters have huge HP modifiers (hence higher ailment thresholds). I can't imagine LA being able to freeze that target better than Ice Shot. (It probably also wouldn't shock it enough). Sure, you can use CotB to convert those lightning damage to cold, but why would you when Ice Shot already exists?

Not sure what is that +2 implicit chains you're talking about. If its the labyrinth enchantment, then I think you've misinterpreted it. It adds +2 target to the secondary effect of +3 side target (making it +5 side target), your projectile still works the same.

Honestly though, I just stayed away from builds having to have 2 6L, but to each their own. It also means it'd be harder to do incremental upgrade on your bow.

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Honestly though, I just stayed away from builds having to have 2 6L

6ls are free this league, whether you krangle or not (because jeweller's/fusings cost nothing atm too).

(Cold) LA is long considered top clearspeed skill on deadeye, right up there with tornado shot, ice shot doesn't come close.

Cone procs without target limit might seem good, but remember that "hits nearby enemies" will proc on every chained / forked enemy, not just once per attack, in effect it's more clear and insane shotgun effect. That w20 kosis/omni on simulacrum in bunch of trash? Blown right up by clearskill shotgunning. (i don't think deadeye bow builds will clear all way through w30 purely from lack of tankiness now, no video showcases for this posted yet as far as i see, mb with mirror phys bow and a ton of 60ex crit multi + life jewels, or some new creative way to get more ehp cheap).

Typical setup is to use awakened fork with deadeye +1 chain and it's setup that 5-way runners will use, and they're very much incentivized to optimize for max clear (to extent which won't crash instance at least, which maxed TS allegedly does).

Btw you don't need to shock bosses at all with LA, LA setup is used only for trash clear(where shock is welcome, will proc to decent extent, but ultimately irrelevant), on some hard bosses you can gemswap second 6l to focused ballista ice shot barrage if you want.

Tell me what can I do to get more offense

https://pastebin.com/9SDzvpDm

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WrongBlight escreveu:

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Honestly though, I just stayed away from builds having to have 2 6L

6ls are free this league, whether you krangle or not (because jeweller's/fusings cost nothing atm too).

(Cold) LA is long considered top clearspeed skill on deadeye, right up there with tornado shot, ice shot doesn't come close.

Cone procs without target limit might seem good, but remember that "hits nearby enemies" will proc on every chained / forked enemy, not just once per attack, in effect it's more clear and insane shotgun effect. That w20 kosis/omni on simulacrum in bunch of trash? Blown right up by clearskill shotgunning. (i don't think deadeye bow builds will clear all way through w30 purely from lack of tankiness now, no video showcases for this posted yet as far as i see, mb with mirror phys bow and a ton of 60ex crit multi + life jewels, or some new creative way to get more ehp cheap).

Typical setup is to use awakened fork with deadeye +1 chain and it's setup that 5-way runners will use, and they're very much incentivized to optimize for max clear (to extent which won't crash instance at least, which maxed TS allegedly does).

Btw you don't need to shock bosses at all with LA, LA setup is used only for trash clear(where shock is welcome, will proc to decent extent, but ultimately irrelevant), on some hard bosses you can gemswap second 6l to focused ballista ice shot barrage if you want.

6L being easy to access this league is an outlier, not the norm. Also Ice Shot cone effects procs regardless of projectile mechanics, similar to LA's hitting nearby enemies. You seem to imply it only occurs once per attack, which it doesn't. Please read the wiki page I've linked in the previous post and you can even test it yourself if you're still not convinced.

The rest of the argument is not really relevant to my build. Things like mirror tier gears, Headhunter + triple Inspired Learning, etc. will of course perform better in a super juiced up contents, but they require a huge amount of investments (whereby I'm not even keen to spend on an extra 6L).

My build concept is based on the following premise as I designed it:
- Optimize the cost / performance ratio
- Need to be easily replicated regardless of league mechanics / your personal earning luck.
- Balanced in eHP & DPS to do most endgame contents (bossing / mapping)
- Overall smoothness to play (minimize active skills , decent MS, clearing w. mob explosions, not having to gemswap, etc.)

The question originally was whether this build would work LA. If I were to design the LA build as closely as this build (accounting the above premise), I stand by my points that Ice Shot is definitively the better skill to play with.

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jaqubeu escreveu:

Tell me what can I do to get more offense

https://pastebin.com/9SDzvpDm

Hello, your 'configuration' tab does not have the relevant checkboxes ticked, so I've made some changes to it for you to start with. You can have a look at the following:
https://pastebin.com/WFWMrjSp

I've also linked Bonechill (do this later when you've got the enchantment), raised Sniper's Mark to 20, replaced Summon Ice Golem with Ensnaring Arrow (You can utilize this later once the pierce from Voidfletcher is gone).

Eitherway you're reaching the end stages of the build, where you'd need to squeeze out the DPS as much as possible. Things you can still do:

1. Flasks. I've slot in silver flasks for onslaught & atziri's promise, as well as rolling a high tier of crit chance on my diamond flask.

2. Glove. Getting a well rolled Puhuarte's glove would really help.

3. Bow. You can still upgrade the bow with something with more attack speed & crit chance. My 3.16 bow is showing 20%++ more DPS in comparison. Again, I need to emphasize to really use POB to compare bows when shopping for it.

4. Blind on hit with Abyss jewel.

5. Enduring composure from small cluster jewel.

6. Brutal Restraint timeless jewel.

7. Anointing your amulet & using catalysts for Mark of the Elder & the amulet.

8. Getting higher rolls on the DPS mods on your gears (Asenath's chant attack speed, body armor flat added cold, amulet attack rolls, mark of the elder ring inc. damage with shaper ring, etc.)

9. Also you definitely need the -mana cost on ring craft for that QOL.

10. Enchantment on helmet to link skitterbot with bonechill

I might have missed something but you can work on those stuffs.

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WrongBlight escreveu:

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Honestly though, I just stayed away from builds having to have 2 6L

6ls are free this league, whether you krangle or not (because jeweller's/fusings cost nothing atm too).

(Cold) LA is long considered top clearspeed skill on deadeye, right up there with tornado shot, ice shot doesn't come close.

Cone procs without target limit might seem good, but remember that "hits nearby enemies" will proc on every chained / forked enemy, not just once per attack, in effect it's more clear and insane shotgun effect. That w20 kosis/omni on simulacrum in bunch of trash? Blown right up by clearskill shotgunning. (i don't think deadeye bow builds will clear all way through w30 purely from lack of tankiness now, no video showcases for this posted yet as far as i see, mb with mirror phys bow and a ton of 60ex crit multi + life jewels, or some new creative way to get more ehp cheap).

Typical setup is to use awakened fork with deadeye +1 chain and it's setup that 5-way runners will use, and they're very much incentivized to optimize for max clear (to extent which won't crash instance at least, which maxed TS allegedly does).

Btw you don't need to shock bosses at all with LA, LA setup is used only for trash clear(where shock is welcome, will proc to decent extent, but ultimately irrelevant), on some hard bosses you can gemswap second 6l to focused ballista ice shot barrage if you want.

+1. I won't elaborate, but you are completely correct.

Ice Shot can work as clear skill, but LA undeniably has better clear, and drawing the line at 2 x 6-link setups is just bizarre. Even if you disregard the cheap prices this league, its normal cost at 2-3ex really isn't out of line with the amounts you will be spending on other pieces of gear, e.g. 6L Hyrri's Ire, non-pierce voidfletcher, asenaths chant, etc.

Its a shame that OP is so stubborn and thinks his build with 1 x 6L setup is better when it results in much lower single target potential and worse clear.

No idea why he is talking about HH or inspired learning, the DPS threshold to clear mobs in T16 maps is like 400k, which even a barebones bow build can hit even while running chain/fork + mirage archer.

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BrettLee escreveu:

+1. I won't elaborate, but you are completely correct.

Ice Shot can work as clear skill, but LA undeniably has better clear, and drawing the line at 2 x 6-link setups is just bizarre. Even if you disregard the cheap prices this league, its normal cost at 2-3ex really isn't out of line with the amounts you will be spending on other pieces of gear, e.g. 6L Hyrri's Ire, non-pierce voidfletcher, asenaths chant, etc.

Its a shame that OP is so stubborn and thinks his build with 1 x 6L setup is better when it results in much lower single target potential and worse clear.

No idea why he is talking about HH or inspired learning, the DPS threshold to clear mobs in T16 maps is like 400k, which even a barebones bow build can hit even while running chain/fork + mirage archer.

Again, let's go back to the original question:

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CharlieTheAnon escreveu:

Hey, awesome guide. Would this build still work with lightning arrow instead?

Keyword is 'would this build still work with LA'. I'm answering him within the context of this build. I feel like people are misinterpreting that I'm implying Ice Shot is objectively better than LA in every situations or build iterations, which I'm not. I'm saying that if people were to simply change the skill gem on the main link from Ice Shot to LA (with as little changes), it would not play as good as the Ice Shot version. Again, please look at the context of that question.

I would've answered that LA is the better version of this build if I've tested it and found it to be as such. But then, wouldn't I be making a guide to LA which is the better version instead?

For example I wouldn't say Tornado Shot is objectively better or worse than Ice Shot, it's just that it scales alot with +additional projectiles. This makes TS scaling very expensive as you try to get those additional sources. Would it be better than Ice Shot at maximum source of add. projectiles? Yes I would say so. Would it be better if I only have +2 add. projectiles from Ascendancy compared to Ice Shot? I would argue no, you're better off using Ice Shot instead. So with a lower budget I'd say my Ice Shot build would fare better off, as mechanically you'd only need Asenath's Chant to make it feel good, with the rest of the gears being mostly numerical improvements.

Again, I can't stress this enough. Context is very important.

p.s. I'm only bringing up HH + triple IL because the other guy brought up 5-way runners and Wave 30 Simu, and with mirror bows and 60ex crit multi jewels, etc.. To put things in perspective, people are still asking me about Lioneye's Fall and how to improve their rare, low-rolled affixes bows and such. My guide is more catered to help these group of players to be able to experience endgame contents.

Haven't played ice shot for several leagues now, decided to pick it up, going to start leveling today.

Thanks for updating guide.

Are we still using barrage support for bossing or we are better of without it?

Edit: https://prnt.sc/1z00zes would you recommend this bow over death's opus?

https://pastebin.com/W0LrPvT5

Hello can u look, and say what i must to do next for progression, and especialy i don't understand where i can get more crit.chance.

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seihty escreveu:

Are we still using barrage support for bossing or we are better of without it?

Edit: https://prnt.sc/1z00zes would you recommend this bow over death's opus?

No longer using Barrage support since build is reducing dependency on additional projectiles. Still can use it if you want though, since it should helps with void shots. Posted bow looks decent enough, try to plug it in POB and remove that mine benchcraft with something else.

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zen1tsuuu escreveu:

https://pastebin.com/W0LrPvT5

Hello can u look, and say what i must to do next for progression, and especialy i don't understand where i can get more crit.chance.

Hello there, please note that you still did not tick the relevant boxes in the POB to properly reflect the stats. Did some of it for you:
https://pastebin.com/h1yKQzJU

On the crit, your base weapon crit is worth more than your other modifiers, since you actual crit scales off that. It is why the modifiers 'Attacks have +% crit chance' on glove corrupt implicit / influenced chest is valuable, because it increases your base crit which scales exponentially with your other crit modifier. With a low base weapon crit like the one you're using, support 'Inc. Crit Strike' would have better DPS contribution than 'Inc. Crit Damage'. I just consider thicket bow as low because it has a 5% base crit chance before mods, vs spine bow at 6.5%.

Anyway some stuff you can improve on:
1. Main skill gems. Why is your Elem. damage with attack & Added Cold at level 5? You should go to level 20 / upgrade to awakened version when you have the chance.

2. Glove suffix of resist can be changed to attack speed. You can use harvest craft to swap around resistance to balance out or straight do a gear upgrade.

3. Higher flat added damage rolls on gears (for example Hyrri's Chest can go 140-200 added cold, try to find something close to that).

4. Flask. Unless MS is really important to you, I would replace the quicksilver flasks with something else like a silver flask for onslaught. Suffix roll can also aim for attack speed / crit chance for further DPS increase.

Always be open for Bow upgrade, doing all of them should push you DPS somewhere to around 2.2-2.5m POB DPS maybe.