Never Ending Dungeon

Strongly supporting this one. Competive gameplay is always nice and this would make you to actually really challenge yourself and your mates.

I'll my my 2 cents too, sounds like lots of people love this idea (I do).

* I would imagine it as a game mode, separate from the story.

* Rankings sounds good.

* However I would prefer to have a save/waypoint system every five levels or so, instead of being stuck for long, unhealthy play sessions.

* It should probably not include any special drops. Or if it does, it would be a way to earn some currency. I say that so as not to devalue the main game areas (remember Diablo II's infamous "cow level"...).

* Opposite of dungeon is the "tower" idea found in many iOS games. Go up, or down. The dungeon (down) could be physical oriented, and the mage tower (up) could be magic oriented (much harder?).

* Earn a title maybe?

* Sounds like something that can add longevity to the game so I don't think the game needs this now, but would be great to have after 1 or 2 years of the game going public.

* Depending how fun it is, I wouldn't mind seeing this as a purchase (keeping in minds, no special drops).

* Now that I think of it, what it could drop is (some of) the store fluff, that is normally paid for, eg: appearance items. So it could be an alternative (a very challenging one) to get "free" stuff, at the end of the dungeon (1 item per run max, or 1 item per week), but would require lots and lots of effort, pretty much requie the player to first be high level, have good gear, etc. Sounds like a good way for GGG to increase player retention.

PS: With that said we already have a taste of this with the pyramid.

Some ideas sounds really great on paper but in practice... hard to say.

The pyramid's repeating tileset and overall randomized pattern gets boring fast, after climbing two times (imho).

So I don't know... to make this less boring it would need to change tileset every couple floors or so, change the monsters, etc. And also change the randomized pattern.

My spin on this idea:

- Access after beating normal, but from then on, you can always go in.
- LOOT is a lot worse than in the rest of the game, or nonexistant
- EXP is reduced as well, so you don't use this challenge as a farming ground
- WAYPOINT every few floors, so you can go back to town and pick up where you left off
- LOWEST FLOOR you reached will be displayed in your char sheet for prestige

BALANCING:
- There is only ONE difficulty
- There is NO scaling when you visit it with groups
- Every floor before a waypoint floor has a boss at the end

That means a group makes a big difference. You are suddenly able to get through floors that were impossible before, and how deep you get reflects the group effort.
Playing through all of it again every time you start won't make any sense, if you are constantly changing groups you play with. With waypoints every 3 or 5 levels, a group can start on the highest floor that every member of the group completed.
That means groups form for certain levels and are most of the time of similar skill, no matter if the single chars a better because of exp, build or equipment.
It's very flexible, you can play with anyone on any difficulty and the only restrictions for how the dungeon is played is set by the members of the groups that visit it.

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golem09 escreveu:

My spin on this idea:

- You only get access after beating normal, but from then on, you can always go in.
- Your character sheets actually displays the lowest floor you've been in, but only for prestige
- The loot is a lot worse than in the rest of the game, or nonexistant
- Every few floors, there are waypoints, so you can go back to town and pick up where you left off

Balancing:
- There is only ONE difficulty
- There is NO scaling when you visit it with groups
- Every floor before a waypoint floor has a boss at the end

That means a group makes a big difference. You are suddenly able to get through floors that were impossible before, and how deep you get reflects the group effort.
Playing through all of it again every time you start won't make any sense, if you are constantly changing groups you play with. With waypoints every 3 or 5 levels, a group can start on the highest floor that every member of the group completed.
That means groups form for certain levels and are most of the time of similar skill, no matter if the single chars a better because of exp, build or equipment.
It's very flexible, you can play with anyone on any difficulty and the only restrictions for how the dungeon is played is set by the members of the groups that visit it.

^This. Great spin on the idea.

"

golem09 escreveu:

My spin on this idea:

- You only get access after beating normal, but from then on, you can always go in.
- Your character sheets actually displays the lowest floor you've been in, but only for prestige
- The loot is a lot worse than in the rest of the game, or nonexistant
- Every few floors, there are waypoints, so you can go back to town and pick up where you left off

Balancing:
- There is only ONE difficulty
- There is NO scaling when you visit it with groups
- Every floor before a waypoint floor has a boss at the end

That means a group makes a big difference. You are suddenly able to get through floors that were impossible before, and how deep you get reflects the group effort.
Playing through all of it again every time you start won't make any sense, if you are constantly changing groups you play with. With waypoints every 3 or 5 levels, a group can start on the highest floor that every member of the group completed.
That means groups form for certain levels and are most of the time of similar skill, no matter if the single chars a better because of exp, build or equipment.
It's very flexible, you can play with anyone on any difficulty and the only restrictions for how the dungeon is played is set by the members of the groups that visit it.

This Idea Sounds Really nice but what about the XP rate? I would use that Tower to Train there if i think i need some lvl´s:), i know many Games that Use That Tower Training System, it was alway´s a fast way to obtain many lvl´s.

"

Takahiro86 escreveu:

This Idea Sounds Really nice but what about the XP rate? I would use that Tower to Train there if i think i need some lvl´s:), i know many Games that Use That Tower Training System, it was alway´s a fast way to obtain many lvl´s.

The way I intended it, it's not a place to train or collect loot, but to prove yourself. So EXP should be cut, so that you have to go elsewhere as well to be able to keep up with the enemies.

Of course it would be fun to have at least occasional, but rare encounters with strong enemies that give good exp/loot, but that should come more as a surprise than as a source you calculate into your endless dungeon play time.

EDIT: I added this to my original concept ;)

"

My spin on this idea:

- Access after beating normal, but from then on, you can always go in.
- LOOT is a lot worse than in the rest of the game, or nonexistant
- EXP is reduced as well, so you don't use this challenge as a farming ground
- WAYPOINT every few floors, so you can go back to town and pick up where you left off
- LOWEST FLOOR you reached will be displayed in your char sheet for prestige

BALANCING:
- There is only ONE difficulty
- There is NO scaling when you visit it with groups
- Every floor before a waypoint floor has a boss at the end

I do think it would be more sensible to scale the difficulty to the players level and stats (and to group members) because of the challenge nature of it. If the first level is appropriate to your character and it gets harder from there, it really is a skillful achievement to reach a deep floor, because even if your equipment is awesome, the difficulty was still just as hard for you as it was for a noob who got less badass monsters that were just as challenging for him. That way, you also don't need waypoints because if you come out with good loot, put it on and enter again, the dungeon starts off harder because of it.
Also it would be essential to have many different mobs and preferably some with interesting abilities to make the fights tactical and diverse.

I find it a lot more interesting to have no scaling at all, because then you wouldn'd just play until you reach level 15, but THE level 15, the same one everyone else encountered and mastered.

It makes you able to compare your skill to others, and also to your other characters.

And as Takahiro already pointed out, in the case of infinite scaling everybody would probably just go into that dungoen once you can access it.

"

golem09 escreveu:

- There is NO scaling when you visit it with groups

If you play such a neverending dungeon in groups though, what's the "prestige" or "achievement"? It would not say anything about your skills.

I think it's much more interesting as a solo experience, because you will have difficulties in some areas if there are weaknesses in your build.