Vendor Recipe: 5-link item -> 7 orbs of fusing.

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SisterBlister escreveu:

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goetzjam escreveu:

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SisterBlister escreveu:

This is suggested so often that GGG should really look into it. Maybe give a blessed orb or something which is nice but not OP. We already have a vendor to get fuses...

I've found a LOT more blessed orbs than 5-links, but I don't bother with the div cards, so it sounds about right.

Its suggested so often because everyone and their mother apparently thinks that just because something is "rare" or somewhat rare it should be valuable.

That isn't and shouldn't be the case.


Changing this now just rewards people for something they largely view as trash now, is that really logical to reward you with something you think is trash now, just because the occurrence is rare?


Whats next introducing a recipe for all the same colors on an item "because its rare"

By that logic, the chrome recipe and the 7-jewellers recipe should also not exist. Do you think they are bad for the game, too?

Both the chrome recipe and the jeweler recipe makes since from a logistical standpoint as a way to give people access to chromes and jewelers. And because jewelers can be turned into fusings at the vendor you don't need to introduce a way to get additional fusings, such as a 5 link,

Furthermore, the chrome and the 6 socket recipe have been in the game for literally years, its part of the game, so instead of pawning off the argument as if I need to prove that already existing ones should have any merit, perhaps you should explain why you think its so important that 5 links reward you more then they currently do.

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I also am puzzled that people think these are ridiculously common. I find maybe 3? 4? on average in a given league, and I am including the flora div card in that number.

You can easily find that in a weekend. Its just "give me more" for something largely viewed as trash after a couple days and it for sure shouldn't be changed just because people think its so rare you should be rewarded for it.

By all means try to come up with any resemblance of an argument for it, instead of just "its rare"

So is 6 all same color on hybrid bases or 4 off colors on a 6 socket base or a number of other things, that doesn't mean it should have value.

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Telperion_sr escreveu:

The only thing I am thinking with this idea is farming for The Flora cards. (1/5 gives 5l staff)

I would love to see something for 5-links, but I think 7 fuses is a bit high since they are so easy to farm.

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Because 5-linked armors/weapons rain from the sky.

They don't drop often at all, but they are very cheap and there are a billion div cards that give 5-links.

Can you imagine that if the change was in effect, their price would also change?

People wouldn't sell them for 1c if they knew they can just vendor them for 7fuses...

That said, setting this price somewhat high would help with:
- rewarding people more for actually finding one
- increasing the base price of a 5L (nowadays it is WAY too easy to get 5L)

People say but Flora card. It is way too common anyways - why not make it rarer in the process?
You also say that this is too much. Is it, really? How many 6S, chaoses, alts and all sort of other currency you get before you find one 5L? Do you REALLY think 5-7fuses per 5L would flip the economy for some reason?

Absolutely solid suggestion.

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goetzjam escreveu:

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I also am puzzled that people think these are ridiculously common. I find maybe 3? 4? on average in a given league, and I am including the flora div card in that number.

You can easily find that in a weekend. Its just "give me more" for something largely viewed as trash after a couple days and it for sure shouldn't be changed just because people think its so rare you should be rewarded for it.

And you can get 20 orbs of fusing in a day from Vorici, for the price of 9.143 6-socket armors (which DO rain from the sky). What's your point? How many 5-links do you, personally, see drop in a given league? 5? 10? 20? Now multiply that number by 7 orbs of fusing and tell me exactly how this is such a huge deal. (I find <5.)

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goetzjam escreveu:

And because jewelers can be turned into fusings at the vendor you don't need to introduce a way to get additional fusings, such as a 5 link,

And one jeweller's orb can be bought with two alts from a vendor, so I ask you again, what is your point? If that argument has any validity at all then we must also say that the 6-socket recipe is ill thought and should be removed.

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goetzjam escreveu:

Furthermore, the chrome and the 6 socket recipe have been in the game for literally years, its part of the game, so instead of pawning off the argument as if I need to prove that already existing ones should have any merit, perhaps you should explain why you think its so important that 5 links reward you more then they currently do.

They don't reward you at all, goetzjam. That 5-linked item could be a 3-linked item, and the vendor result would be identical.

You do implicitly bring up another point which is worth addressing, however:

Why should any item give a currency return upon vendoring?

You don't attempt to answer this question yourself (though you could make a much stronger counter-argument if you did), but I will. I think that such recipes are implemented for two primary reasons:

1) To afford access to an otherwise (relatively) difficult-to-attain currency, as a reward to observant players. (RGB items are an example, as are 6-socket items.)

2) To create an item sink, so that items don't flood the economy, and so people don't feel as bad when they drop a rare and useful (no, NOT just rare, so you can drop that strawman already) item which they have no immediate need for. (This is where I think the game could do better, particularly with regard to vendoring unique items.)

A 5-link recipe would be perfectly consistent with what the game already does. The reason the suggestion comes up so often is because people are genuinely surprised that a 5-link does not return anything good. It is literally the inconsistency which surprises people.

And the desire for a measure of intuitiveness and consistency is the only reason I made this suggestion. Why the fuck do I care about an extra 40 fusings per 300 hours of play?

I happen to appreciate devil's advocates, goetzjam, but I often get the impression that you argue against ideas for the sake of being contrary and not because you have a genuine objection.

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And you can get 20 orbs of fusing in a day from Vorici, for the price of 9.143 6-socket armors (which DO rain from the sky). What's your point? How many 5-links do you, personally, see drop in a given league? 5? 10? 20? Now multiply that number by 7 orbs of fusing and tell me exactly how this is such a huge deal. (I find <5.)

And if it isn't that big of a deal, why waste dev time discussing it and changing it. People have played without it giving you anything additional for years. I have yet to see a compelling arguement for the change.

"its rare" isn't good enough. So is a mjolner and it would effectively be worth less then this so called 5 link sword or whatever you currently don't pickup now anyway.

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And one jeweller's orb can be bought with two alts from a vendor, so I ask you again, what is your point? If that argument has any validity at all then we must also say that the 6-socket recipe is ill thought and should be removed.

And you shouldn't have to convert more then once, following that logic, converting from jewelers to fusings make sense.

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Why should any item give a currency return upon vendoring?

You don't attempt to answer this question yourself (though you could make a much stronger counter-argument if you did), but I will. I think that such recipes are implemented for two primary reasons:

1) To afford access to an otherwise (relatively) difficult-to-attain currency, as a reward to observant players. (RGB items are an example, as are 6-socket items.)

2) To create an item sink, so that items don't flood the economy, and so people don't feel as bad when they drop a rare and useful (no, NOT just rare, so you can drop that strawman already) item which they have no immediate need for. (This is where I think the game could do better, particularly with regard to vendoring unique items.)

A 5-link recipe would be perfectly consistent with what the game already does. The reason the suggestion comes up so often is because people are genuinely surprised that a 5-link does not return anything good. It is literally the inconsistency which surprises people.

And the desire for a measure of intuitiveness and consistency is the only reason I made this post. Why the fuck do I care about an extra 40 fusings per 300 hours of play?

I happen to appreciate devil's advocates, but in this case I honestly think you are arguing against this idea for the sake of being contrary and little else.

I'm not the one saying it needs to be added, you are. You convince me why it needs to change, I don't have to convince you why it should stay the same.


1) That is true, but that was before loot filters. If anything loot filters are a perfect argument against giving an additional reward for a 5 link.

2) 5 link weapons, sans staffs and maybe bow have always been pretty useless, again useless + rare = no value. If these items had economical value now they would be worth picking up, but due to various changes in the game over time, stuff like this will probably always remain worthless and that is perfectly fine.


Its not consistent at all. 5 link isn't a full\complete item.

3 linked colors is a complete set of colors on an item.

6 sockets is a full amount of sockets

6 link is a completely linked item


you know what a 5 link item is, nothing.


IF 5 links were to need to turn into anything, it would be a blessed orb, which has LESS value then the 7 jews you currently get for a 6 socket version. So unless they made it only apply to a 5 socket 5 link item, then many people would actually be unhappy with the change.


At a time and point in the game where GGG should be actively decreasing the amount of returns and currency players get, its absolutely not the right time to ask for increased rewards for something like this. That is why i'm so against it, not to mention its literally worked the way it has for years, the change is unnecessary and pointless.


Regarding the last point, I'm legitimately against this change, perhaps certain topics I oppose just for the sake of seeing a good argument, this isn't one of those cases. Although I'm always open to hear why its so important this gets changed, after my explanation of why it is consistent it rewards you with nothing.

Your definition of completeness is arbitrary.

Your return to the rareness argument is a strawman (reread my explicit reference to that).

And your argument that minor improvements are not worth making ("And if it isn't that big of a deal, why waste dev time discussing it and changing it") is baffling.

I don't need to convince you of anything, goetzjam. I made a reasonable suggestion for a minor change, and you said it was a bad idea. So tell us why it is so horrible, please.

By all means, be your usual contrary self. As I said, I like a good devil's advocate. But let me be more specific: I like a good devil's advocate.

This is a piddling amount of currency put into the economy, in exchange for a more intuitive vendor return. I fail to grasp why you think this will hurt the game more than help it, but I am willing to read/listen.

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goetzjam escreveu:

I have yet to see a compelling arguement for the change.

Excuse me, but it is very hard to take your responses seriously if you put that bit in. There has been multiple good arguments presented. You may not think they are compelling, but there are here.

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goetzjam escreveu:

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SisterBlister escreveu:

This is suggested so often that GGG should really look into it. Maybe give a blessed orb or something which is nice but not OP. We already have a vendor to get fuses...

I've found a LOT more blessed orbs than 5-links, but I don't bother with the div cards, so it sounds about right.

Its suggested so often because everyone and their mother apparently thinks that just because something is "rare" or somewhat rare it should be valuable.

That isn't and shouldn't be the case.


Changing this now just rewards people for something they largely view as trash now, is that really logical to reward you with something you think is trash now, just because the occurrence is rare?


Whats next introducing a recipe for all the same colors on an item "because its rare"

IC the neysayer still at it ...

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goetzjam escreveu:

...Existing things in the game are good, suggested changes for very similar things are bad...

Sorry, goat, but this is what you always write to every suggestion ever. If GGG listened to you, we'd still have Piety as the end boss and no breaches, abysses, strongboxes, etc...

The reason so many people suggest/support a small reward for a 5L is because - like all games - POE is played for its rewards. Of course, if every 5L would give an Ex, "reward saturation" and thus boredom would set in really quickly, but a small reward for something pretty rare is miles better from a game perspective than a small disappointment each time this rare event occurs.

I still think a blessed orb would be a better reward than fusings, because we can already buy fusings from vendors, while there is no way to get Blessed orbs outside of drops. Neither would ruin the precious economeh, so this is just a small point.

As an regular Solo Self Fuck player i think that there should be something for 5l items. At least 1 fuse. Anything than current state.

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SisterBlister escreveu:

I still think a blessed orb would be a better reward than fusings, because we can already buy fusings from vendors, while there is no way to get Blessed orbs outside of drops. Neither would ruin the precious economeh, so this is just a small point.

Incidentally, my reason for suggesting fusing orbs was not arbitrary. The current recipes for chromes, jeweller's orbs, blacksmith's whetstones, etc. all follow a simple logic: The currency item you would use to create the relevant item is the currency you are rewarded with.

Since my suggestion has less to do with increasing currency availability and everything to do with improving the game's intuitiveness, I would not advocate a blessed orb reward for a 5-link. I would advocate a reward of orbs of fusing (the amount can be argued), because that is the orb which would be used to create a 5-link in the first place.