I always hear namelocking is 'bad' in PoE. Is it also 'bad' in other ARPGs ?

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grepman escreveu:

right, so we're getting warmer :) come on people, just say you don't want to aim and that is tiring as opposed just rushing through clicking wherever the fuck on the screen and killing shit.

Where have I denied that?

So far we have these points going for namelock assist:
- ergonomy
- arpg game design
- common sense
- everybody else has it so it's a habitual thing too, very important in consumer driven industry

It's physically unfeasible even in a game that is much slower paced than PoE, which is why other games have the feature. Try playing the next league with a single target skill in splash-no-ms flavor and you'll see my point.

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grepman escreveu:

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raics escreveu:

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grepman escreveu:

if so, people dont really not like the mechanic, they just dont like that its weaker, by that logic. so if we give namelock skills 200% more damage, would that outweigh the downsides of namelock ? but Im somewhat skeptical this happens, in reality people still will not like namelock.

It won't, the sheer annoyance of trying to click on something and failing is hard to overcome. Besides, it would be ridiculous for boss fights if you can fit two high link setups.

The problem there is you can keep up with namelocking a boss, they're big and the fight doesn't last long. However keeping up the focus over half an hour is murder, believe it or not, I've actually tried using splash Dual Strike without ms in higher maps recently and wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

right, so we're getting warmer :) come on people, just say you don't want to aim and that is tiring as opposed just rushing through clicking wherever the fuck on the screen and killing shit.

and lets not pretend skills like molten strike or lighting strike arent inherently 'area' skills, because they are - they attack a spatial area instead of a specific mob.

Are you even reading those posts? Or are you just trolling to get a response out of people?

Because thats not an reply to raics post, thats baiting someone to get a rise out of him.

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Cataca escreveu:

Are you even reading those posts? Or are you just trolling to get a response out of people?

Because thats not an reply to raics post, thats baiting someone to get a rise out of him.

Shhh, don't bother the man while he's combing the thread to find a post where I said that people are hardworking by nature and especially love pointless effort. That would extend the thread by two pages at least.

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Cataca escreveu:

Are you even reading those posts? Or are you just trolling to get a response out of people?

Because thats not an reply to raics post, thats baiting someone to get a rise out of him.

seriously, no.
raics is a good poster, I would never troll him. I rarely troll.

he himself admitted as much in the previous post, didnt he ?

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raics escreveu:

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Cataca escreveu:

Are you even reading those posts? Or are you just trolling to get a response out of people?

Because thats not an reply to raics post, thats baiting someone to get a rise out of him.

Shhh, don't bother the man while he's combing the thread to find a post where I said that people are hardworking by nature and especially love pointless effort. That would extend the thread by two pages at least.

huh ?

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grepman escreveu:

he himself admitted as much in the previous post, didnt he ?

I have, sure, though it's more of a case of "can't" than "don't want" if you've been reading between the lines. I don't mind clicking on every enemy in early game, actually I enjoy early levelling, strangely enough.

However, you just can't keep that up for the whole game, it gets too fast and enemies way too numerous later on. It's a fool's errand, an errand I can comfortably do in other games without feeling like a fool at all. I also think that splashed single target skills should be usable without MS and that pretty much settles it for me, I'm not budging.

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raics escreveu:

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grepman escreveu:

he himself admitted as much in the previous post, didnt he ?

I have, sure, though it's more of a case of "can't" than "don't want" if you've been reading between the lines. I don't mind clicking on every enemy in early game, actually I enjoy early levelling, strangely enough.

However, you just can't keep that up for the whole game, it gets too fast and enemies way too numerous later on. It's a fool's errand, an errand which I can comfortably do in other games.

And thats exactly the issue. At 10 attacks per second, where 3 of them have to be targeted just to initiate the skill, you need to constantly reshift your target to a still living mob on the screen to not waste one third of your attacks, it is an utterly mindwrecking experience.

Or you stubbornly hold down shift+ attack key. Which is basically what endgame with namelock skills looks like now.

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Cataca escreveu:

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grepman escreveu:

your first point was precision. you want a namelock to behave like aoe skill. this only raises more questions than answers anything.

My first point was that if you target empty space even in the utmost vicinity of a mob, you will not initiate said skill (no matter how you bind it), but instead walk there.

Pray tell, i didnt even say anything about automatically hitting the target. Initiating the skill as if you shift clicked would be alright. With the attack speed as is, and the number of screens you traverse per minute, its just one of the many things that add unneeded awkwardness to the system. That is wasted time because of accidentially walking somewhere, instead of hitting something.

you yourself say, shift clicked. shift attacking prevents walking somewhere accidentally, doesnt it ? so what exactly prevents you from a)walking to the target 2)shift clicking ?

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grepman escreveu:

I dont understand why someone would hate to miss air when they click air

You dont. You dont even start hitting. You take a stroll.

shift is your friend, again.

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So, you say our battle-hardened characters have the spacial awareness of a toddler, and that is totally fine.

Im not terribly interested in lore/thematic connotations with a game where mechanics and stats are king...are you justifying your desire for autoaim with the whole 'warrior is not me therefore he should not be missing'...really ?

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And your underlying message is that this is somehow equivalent to skill. Something completely out of the control of the player. mhm.

never indicated that its equivalent to skill. it does, however, take a bigger effort to focus on a target and predict its movement pattern, then just select a spot and press the button for aoe slam.

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Yes. We want "press x" to win. Thats exactly what everyone is saying.

glad you admit it

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Yet you defend namelocking as something that you correlate with skill? That wrecks my brain.

again, I dont defend namelock. I attack your desire to autoaim, which then makes it the only logical conclusion to replace namelock wtih aoe, because namelock by nature isnt autoaim.

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grepman escreveu:

how does mob density influence namelock though ? a single target skill should hit one target, logically, no ? namelock or no namelock.

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Poe? Jackhammer. Are you seriously expecting people to retarget every 0.10 seconds?

see, we're getting warmer here as well - to the more underlying problem that aoe is king in poe and it takes less effort to cast an aoe nuke that constantly retarget.

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raics escreveu:

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grepman escreveu:

he himself admitted as much in the previous post, didnt he ?

I have, sure, though it's more of a case of "can't" than "don't want" if you've been reading between the lines. I don't mind clicking on every enemy in early game, actually I enjoy early levelling, strangely enough.

However, you just can't keep that up for the whole game, it gets too fast and enemies way too numerous later on. It's a fool's errand, an errand I can comfortably do in other games without feeling like a fool at all. I also think that splashed single target skills should be usable without MS and that pretty much settles it for me, I'm not budging.

fair enough, I think your explanation at this point is thorough and I thank you for your patience.

Im pretty aggressive in my arguments by nature, so dont take it personal or anything. That's how I roll. I like arguing about games, if you haven't noticed.

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grepman escreveu:

Im pretty aggressive in my arguments by nature, so dont take it personal or anything. That's how I roll. I like arguing about games, if you haven't noticed.

No worries, this is a game within a game and I also get a great deal of enjoyment out of it :)

You probably already know how I feel about game pace in PoE, if that was the point of the thread.